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  #21  
Old 02-03-2015
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I am finding that over larger faster jumps/landings that my front forks are bottoming out quite badly.
I have adjusted the compression in clockwise as far as it will go.
Without going to a heavier fork spring can oil be added to the fork to avoid this bottoming out?
The rear shock seams to be handling the landing better than the front does. This happens when the landings are front or rear wheel first?
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  #22  
Old 18-11-2015
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Hi,
I've never been one to muck around with clickers on previous bikes because ive always been happy with how they handle. However with my 2012 wr450f i'm not totally happy with the suspension.

My main concern is the front end. When cornering in loose terrain to the front end wants to push through the corner rather than gripping up and turning. This only happens when I'm pushing hard and not always.

So to my way of thinking softening up the front end should rectify this problem. I have springs rated to my weight so that shouldnt be an issue. So if I soften the compression damping, should I be adjusting the rebound damping as well, or should I be doing one of these but not both.

The compression clickers were set at 13 clicks out and I wound them out to 16. I just had a quick test run and it seemed better, but i was wearing shorts and t shirt so I wasnt pushing too hard. The owners manual suggests that the clickers shouldnt be any more than 20 clicks out so I'm wary of going too much further. I havent adjusted the rebound clickers but I would assume they are at the stock setting.

Any tips before I go any further would be appreciated.
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  #23  
Old 18-11-2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by normanator27 View Post
Hi,
I've never been one to muck around with clickers on previous bikes because ive always been happy with how they handle. However with my 2012 wr450f i'm not totally happy with the suspension.

My main concern is the front end. When cornering in loose terrain to the front end wants to push through the corner rather than gripping up and turning. This only happens when I'm pushing hard and not always.

So to my way of thinking softening up the front end should rectify this problem. I have springs rated to my weight so that shouldnt be an issue. So if I soften the compression damping, should I be adjusting the rebound damping as well, or should I be doing one of these but not both.

The compression clickers were set at 13 clicks out and I wound them out to 16. I just had a quick test run and it seemed better, but i was wearing shorts and t shirt so I wasnt pushing too hard. The owners manual suggests that the clickers shouldnt be any more than 20 clicks out so I'm wary of going too much further. I havent adjusted the rebound clickers but I would assume they are at the stock setting.

Any tips before I go any further would be appreciated.
Softening will be the worst thing you can do unfortunately...

For loose cornering the compression needs to be between half and 2 thirds in. So lets say you have 20 clicks on compression, you would set them between 12 and 15.

If you have the same amount of clicks on rebound then your rebound needs to be slightly harder - 2 to 3 clicks.
They always need to stay at that ratio roughly.

The reason for this is simple - if your compression is softer it will use more of the stroke so your suspension will not be pushing your tyre into the ground which is how you get traction.

Rear is different but more important than front. 70%+ of your suspension is done by the shock...

Hope this helps.

Stu
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  #24  
Old 18-11-2015
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Clickers are simply a free bleed variable (oil free bleeing through an orifice of fixed size). Closing the clicker restricts the orifice, and opening allows more fluid to pass.

At higher velocities the volume of oil to be moved will overcome the ability of the orifice and shim deflection will have to occur, which leads us to the shim stack. It works in conjunction with the bleed as both will be involved in any movement, and as such a softer stack may result in the clickers being closed further, or a stiffer stack being open further.

You have piston and port design, bleed shims (not entirely closing the ports off), and bleed holes drilled in pistons (fixed orifice ports).

Add to that, the compression clicker acts on the base valve, and the rebound on the mid valve piston, and statements about certain clickers needing to be in certain positions can only work for given setups and scenarios.

In many cases I feel compression adjustments impact bump absorption, which is a major variable in itself. Rebound simply controls the return stroke (spring energy). If the suspension doesn't control the rebound the bike will be unsettled, want to unload, and can often want to wash or push in corners. On the contrary, adding rebound damping (closing clicker/stiffer stacks) will add control and help it feel settled, but if you slow things down too much you risk the suspension not being able to extend back out enough to deal with the next bump/impact aka 'packing down'. You also want the front and back to work in harmony.

Last edited by Jakobi; 18-11-2015 at 08:46 PM.
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  #25  
Old 28-11-2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icebergstu View Post
Softening will be the worst thing you can do unfortunately...



Rear is different but more important than front. 70%+ of your suspension is done by the shock...



Stu
It took me a bit of thinking but I finally got my head around the softening/hardening concept. I think im getting closer to getting it feeling right. After a chat with my mechanic I realised I had the forks not far enough through the triple clamp. Changing this has made a huge difference. I also realise now that my riders sag wasnt set properly either. We live and learn though.

Jakobi made a comment about the front and back feeling in harmony and I see that now. Its funny how changes on the front affect how the back feels and vice versa. Ive found some settings given by terry hay for my bike which i'm using as a baseline setting. The bike feels a lot more planted, different to what I'm used to though. I need to have a good long ride to get used to it. Cheers Gents.
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  #26  
Old 09-01-2016
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After a delay in proceedings I have made gains by hardening the suspension up (thanks stu). My next question is, in hardening up the suspension, apart from weighing up between ride comfort and handling, is there anything else I need to consider before hardening things further? Cheers.
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  #27  
Old 11-01-2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by normanator27 View Post
After a delay in proceedings I have made gains by hardening the suspension up (thanks stu). My next question is, in hardening up the suspension, apart from weighing up between ride comfort and handling, is there anything else I need to consider before hardening things further? Cheers.
Once the suspension becomes too firm, apart from a loss of comfort, you can also loose traction, loose stability and the bike wont settle into corners as well.

It cost nothing but a little time to try different settings. Do it.
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  #28  
Old 12-01-2016
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Originally Posted by dwb79 View Post

It cost nothing but a little time to try different settings. Do it.
Exactly!!!

I haven't been on many rides where I haven't made some adjustments. Any good tuner will tell you to get out there and click away.

You will stuff it up. The bike will feel terrible. It will be all over the place and then so harsh you think your wrist, elbow and shoulders will dislocate.
The back will get so wrong that you will be bouncing off every little root and stone.

If you dont stuff it up, you wont know how good, good is.

Constantly play with your clickers. Its always better not to be in a hurry anyway.

Stu
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